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Insanity: Toew & Kane signed at 84 million, 8 year, NMC

P

proxy

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xentr_thread_starter
I don't know what the Hawks are smoking. Didn't we just have a lockout for this kind of crap?

Kane and Toews are far from being the best players in the league and now they're the highest paid ones.

You can offer any one, or even two of large dollar value, long term, or a no trade/no movement clause to get a contract done. But to give all three?

This after Keith and Sharp sign value contracts to keep the team financially flexible. If Kane and Toews were European players they'd be getting lambasted as money grubbing no heart selfish players etc.

I shudder to think what Hall and Eberle will get when their current contracts expire.
 
I agree, this is gonna hurt Hawks long term because one thing I have noticed is that NHL cap doesn't move as well as the NFL one, and I do think i noticed it shrinking in some years.
 
That is way too much for Kane and Toews. There's no way they're worth more than Crosby or Ovechkin. If this is the current trend, Ottawa will have serious problems trying to sign/re-sign current players like Ryan and Karlsson when their contracts are up. Not to mention our owner is broke and only spends to the cap floor.
 
proxy said:
I don't know what the Hawks are smoking. Didn't we just have a lockout for this kind of crap?
Click to expand...

No. Contracts like these are not what the lockout was about. In fact, they are a product of those CBA negotiations.

rovert said:
That is way too much for Kane and Toews. There's no way they're worth more than Crosby or Ovechkin. If this is the current trend, Ottawa will have serious problems trying to sign/re-sign current players like Ryan and Karlsson when their contracts are up. Not to mention our owner is broke and only spends to the cap floor.
Click to expand...
The deals Sid and Ovie signed are not comparable because they were signed under the previous CBA. Plus it's well-recognized Sid gave the Pens a big hometown discount.

The deals are fair. In the open market, those players would receive max offers. No question. Chicago is obviously betting the cap will increase significantly through the 8 year span of the deals.

The Pens made the same bet last year when they signed Letang to a big deal; and lost because the cap did not increase as much as expected. This was a factor in Shero's firing. Furthermore, Letang suffered a non-career ending stroke that makes him presently untradeable.
 
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lol at the notion that Kane and Toews are nowhere near the best players. Stats wise, perhaps. But those two are the main catalysts for their last two cups. Cindy and Gina still only have one.

And with Melnyk being too cheap to compete, that was always going to be the case, regardless if better players get paid more on other teams. He should get out of the business if he doesn't want to ice a winner. Or the reality, he's making a ton of money without having to win Cups. He's smart!
 
xentr_thread_starter
Bao, it's not just 2 guys that win a cup, the support cast in Chicago is much better than in Pittsburgh or Washington. Duncan Keith, Patrick Sharp, and Marian Hossa are all very near in value/contribution to those cup wins.
What Toews and Kane have done is hamstring Chicago cap wise for the next 8 years.

Desiato has it right though, Chicago is betting that the cap rises significantly throughout the duration of the next 9 years. Toews and Kane aren't worth 10.5 million per season though, I'd have expected them to sign for 7-8 million each, that 7-5 million savings in cap space would have gone a long way to filling out the rest of the lineup depth.
 
proxy said:
Bao, it's not just 2 guys that win a cup, the support cast in Chicago is much better than in Pittsburgh or Washington. Duncan Keith, Patrick Sharp, and Marian Hossa are all very near in value/contribution to those cup wins.
What Toews and Kane have done is hamstring Chicago cap wise for the next 8 years.

Desiato has it right though, Chicago is betting that the cap rises significantly throughout the duration of the next 9 years. Toews and Kane aren't worth 10.5 million per season though, I'd have expected them to sign for 7-8 million each, that 7-5 million savings in cap space would have gone a long way to filling out the rest of the lineup depth.
Click to expand...

Of course the Hawks have a better group that contributed to their two cup wins. Keith, Sharp, Hossa, and Seabrook are all very strong contributors that keeps the Hawks in the conversation for Cup contenders every year. But not a single one of them could be identified as franchise players. Kane and Toews are both such players.

There was no way in hell that they were going to take $7-8M. They COULD have taken a lot less to help make Bowman's life easier. But why should it be on the players? Why do employees have to make sacrifices? Fair market value next year and beyond for a top 5 centre, and a top 5 winger is north of $11M. They accepted less. Now that it has made the GM's job harder, not their issue. The GM isn't working for fun or for free. If he can't find a way to make this work, he wouldn't have made the deal, or he'll get fired. That's life and business.

The fact that Crosby and Ovechkin (not clear cut miles better than Toews and Kane by the way), sacrificed some of their upper income potential to help the GM out or whatever. 1: foolish. 2: they got betrayed anyway.

Ultimately, I was hoping that they would not sign, to give a chance for two amazing players to go to other teams. But they decided to stay, took a small home town discount as well. The other alternative was to go to UFA, sign for $14M+ in a nothing market like Phoenix, Florida etc and get paid well to not care. Or take a small home town discount and stay loyal to the team and market that drafted them. Staying at 50% of their market value was never ever going to happen.
 
xentr_thread_starter
We'll have to disagree then. I don't think Kane or Toews are franchise cornerstone players.
 
proxy said:
We'll have to disagree then. I don't think Kane or Toews are franchise cornerstone players.
Click to expand...

It's perfectly fair to disagree.

We're both from Toronto so we probably have no idea of what a true franchise player is. But you suggested they take even less than what fatty Phil is going to be making ($8M).

Both are former Conn Smythe winners. Neither player puts up the points like Crosby, Malkin, or Ovechkin (but so few do). If you get the chance, watch them a bit more. And more so with Toews, there's a lot of chatter from real experts that puts him in the upper echelon of top centres. I'd still pick Crosby over Toews. But not by much. General consensus for the "if you can pick a franchise centre"... Crosby would get the most votes, Toews and Malkin would be neck and neck for 2nd... then a bunch of crickets after that. The best way to describe Toews is his incredible two way play coupled with clutch scoring. I really wish we had someone like that in Toronto.
 
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