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What am I doing wrong?

clshades

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Wrong. You have no idea about scientific testing. If all the variables remain the same and you're only changing one thing it's still a valid test regardless of the test environment. It doesn't matter if it's in or out of a case. All that affects is the absolute temperature. The whole point is that the loop order doesn't matter.

Of course it matters if it's in or out of the case. Which way does the air come from when you drive your car down the road? The same principle applys.

Also I'm a plumber, going on 10 years. Water cooling a computer correctly is child's play compared to what I do for a living bud. It's ok man. I water cooled wrong for years until I finally pulled my head out of my ass and learned.

Plumbing school, scientfically, helped me understand the principles better, including some of the equations that go along with those principles. The problem being, a computer water cooling is so small, it's actually difficult to refine the math involved on paper.

Most, and I mean pretty much all, heating or cooling systems do it all at once before it goes into the system and then branches. Kinda like blood in your body.

So all the cooling happens in a cooling tower (cooling) or boiler (heating). It doesn't cool off, go down a pipe, and then cool something and then cool off again and then cool somwthing. The more time water gets to spend being cooled or heated before doing its job the better. This is why we have pump curves for efficiency.

I have stood over my last setup with thermal probes, thermal sensors all over the case. Measuring everything until I found the best scenario. Best setup for ME was: back to back 360 rads before cooling any cores. And EVERY fan was pulling room air. Pump was half speed as full speed was a few degrees warmer on the cores under load. In the winter under max load (folding@home) my cpu was never higher than 25c and the video never broke 45c. My cpu idled at 2c over ambient.

So tell me my man, who do ya think is doing it right? The problem you're having is A/ fan direction. B/ thinking internal case air is fine when it's totally not.
 
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JD

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I don't think you mentioned what CPU you have, is it a 65W or 105W model?

As Izerous mentioned, that Swiftech pump, since it's not powered, is likely adding a ton of restriction to your loop. You're using the force of the water to spin the impeller currently. I'd be curious to put a flow rate sensor on the top of your reservoir to see what's the "end" flow rate. Your biggest rad probably has the lowest flowrate currently.

You're also dumping all the heat output of the bottom 3070 and front 360 rad into your rear & top rads, so as clshades keeps saying, you should make all your radiators have their fans blowing into the case so they can get the coolest air possible. The air temp inside your case is probably 40C+ after a few hours I'd suspect. What temps do your motherboard sensors say? Things like the VRM, Chipset, etc. The water sitting in the tubes/reservoir will absorb that heat too.

My suggestion would be to remove the Swiftech pump/rad combo, change the rear rad to be intake, put 2-3 fans installed in the top as exhaust
 

clshades

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Orange tube setup was like my 5th attempt at water cooling maybe. Braineater made the CPU bracket for me, I loved that thing and, it was a long time ago. 1st attempt ever, was a complete kit thing that was rather crappy and I have no photos of it. I do remember spraying my motherboard and video card because I didn't connect a tube properly. So that was a fun week waiting for things to dry out. 🤦‍♂️

Middle photo was my dual 7970? God that was a long long time ago now. It ran really well but still not as good as the last build I did. Lowfat helped me with configuration of fans etc. Best advice I ever got. The plumbing school aspect came a year or two later when I learned about pump curves. For a week I sat there with probes, measuring inside air temps, water temps, mobo-cpu-gpu temps. I Played with fan speeds and pump speeds until I hit the sweet spot. We are only talking about a few degrees either way but it was measurable. I guarantee Jay didn't do anything remotely close in testing like I did. I spent multiple late nights reading every last piece of info I could find to tweak this thing. My ambient air temp was 16-20c depending on the day. In the photo you can see one of my temp probes. It measured the air temp off the bottom rad inside the case. Definitely summer time.

1st couple photos is the setup I was referring too. North and southbridge cooling, VRM cooling, CPU cooling, Kingpin cooling. CPU idled at 2c over ambient, GPU was overclocked to the limit and never got over 45c. This rig would overclock like crazy with zero issues or cooling problems. If I had another 1000 dollars to play with I could have made this look even sweeter. Tough to do as an apprentice plumber. Most of the stuff was bought used too.

Anyway, I spent many weeks and hundreds of hours learning water cooling. I'd like to think I have a pretty good understanding of it after 20 odd years of doing it. @lowfat definitely saved me a lot of aggravation in the latter of the 20 years. I had planned to do a full copper tube build but ended up moving to a ski mountain and just ran out of spare time as the kids grew up.
 

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sbug206

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I'm not arguing about your results. You claimed Jayz video is wrong because it's not in a case and you had to have your rads before everything else. It's a closed loop. LOOP ORDER DOES NOT MATTER. Whether it's ABC or BCA or CAB it makes no difference on the final temperature. We're not arguing what the final temperature is. It could be in a freezer or sauna but the way you arrange your components in the loop DOESN'T MATTER. When you test something, if everything stays the same and only one variable changes (the loop order) then the test is valid. It doesn't matter whether his rad was inside a case, it was still exchanging heat with a fixed variable (room temp).
 

sswilson

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Orange tube setup was like my 5th attempt at water cooling maybe. Braineater made the CPU bracket for me, I loved that thing and, it was a long time ago. 1st attempt ever, was a complete kit thing that was rather crappy and I have no photos of it. I do remember spraying my motherboard and video card because I didn't connect a tube properly. So that was a fun week waiting for things to dry out. 🤦‍♂️

I'd have to check my tickle trunk but that block/bracket is still in the community. (It's either here, or I might have used it for the loop I set up on my young lad's PC so it'd be just up the street... :) ).
 

Shadowmeph

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I remember when I first made my set up I was running my p[ump at full but temps seemed almost the same as the old fan cooling so I turned my pump way down my tempers seemed to drop, also ambient temperatures do come into play sp if there isn't any air movement inside the case it an effect cooling meaning outside air getting in if your pulling in air from the outside through a rad it will warm the inside case air up so it will create more heat. so no matter how fast your fans are pushing pulled through the rads it still is pushing pulling warmer air. at least this was also what happened tome years back when I had two looks one for my video card and one for my CPU so moved to single rad one loop push-pull and a few fresh air intake fans with a single pump turned down. now I have a huge res and only cool my CPU but also in a very large case huge fan in the from pulling air in and two fans rear my rad is mounted inside on top where this also two huge fans pulling air out but I also have two smalled fans pushing air through my 120 rad at this time, my temps when gaming Ark barely break 50 c and this is with an older 480 8gb AMD card with all that heat, but also my PC is next to my balcony window that is always open so it is sucking in the cold air from the window,. but even in the summertime before the heatwave, my cpu which os OCed as high as I can get it barely broke 65c now my GPU was pretty much melting hehe.
but I am sure every situation and set up is different
 

clshades

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I'm not arguing about your results. You claimed Jayz video is wrong because it's not in a case and you had to have your rads before everything else. It's a closed loop. LOOP ORDER DOES NOT MATTER. Whether it's ABC or BCA or CAB it makes no difference on the final temperature. We're not arguing what the final temperature is. It could be in a freezer or sauna but the way you arrange your components in the loop DOESN'T MATTER. When you test something, if everything stays the same and only one variable changes (the loop order) then the test is valid. It doesn't matter whether his rad was inside a case, it was still exchanging heat with a fixed variable (room temp).

It does matter
I'm not arguing about your results. You claimed Jayz video is wrong because it's not in a case and you had to have your rads before everything else. It's a closed loop. LOOP ORDER DOES NOT MATTER. Whether it's ABC or BCA or CAB it makes no difference on the final temperature. We're not arguing what the final temperature is. It could be in a freezer or sauna but the way you arrange your components in the loop DOESN'T MATTER. When you test something, if everything stays the same and only one variable changes (the loop order) then the test is valid. It doesn't matter whether his rad was inside a case, it was still exchanging heat with a fixed variable (room temp).

Ok whatever man. You aren't here for help you are here to argue. Good luck.
 

clshades

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I'd have to check my tickle trunk but that block/bracket is still in the community. (It's either here, or I might have used it for the loop I set up on my young lad's PC so it'd be just up the street... :) ).
Haha is that where it went? I'd forgotten about it until I went looking for old PC pics.
 

draemn

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So you didn't even tell us what your temperatures are... water temperature doesn't really matter and give us any indication of if your loop is cooling components better or worse.

End of the day, the best thing for a loop is to pull cold air in from the outside of the case. If you only had a CPU cooler, it might be better to exhaust the hot air, but since the GPU is water cooled that isn't an issue.

And why the heck do you come to ask for advice and then just argue with people?
 

sswilson

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Haha is that where it went? I'd forgotten about it until I went looking for old PC pics.

Unless I'm mistaken, it's the block I used for my parallel GPU/CPU loop.... :)

 

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