Jack Layton dies at 61
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1. media is playing this up a lot. If you liked the NDP and Leyton, the media coverage might be considered comforting. If you did not, it has to be a bit tiresome at this point. I can understand both viewpoints.
2. Leyton gave 'the best days' of his life for sure for Canadians. Some folks will go so far as to say his recent campaigning took the good out of him (he certainly got very sick right after the election). That said, I would not compare his work to the dangers faced each night and day by our armed forces and police officers, who expect to be put into danger each time they punch the clock.
3. You can't compare Leyton to any other MP or party leader. He holds the office of the leader of the opposition, which is something worth noting over the other MPs (we even provide an official opposition leader residence called Stornoway, and when the government loses confidence of the house he can be asked to be the new PM...so he is high on the PM list in our system). I personally think we should get rid of all state funerals, but it is not absurd that if you should have one, a sitting opposition leader would be a candidate to have one.
4. I think Leyton should be proud of the name "Taliban Jack." He advocated a position years ago that the Pentagon is just now realizing. He stood up for this when it politically incorrect to do so. That takes pure guts, and we don't have many politicians with guts today. You don't have to agree with him, but many others have come around to.
Otherwise, not much more to say other than the same old arguments that we tend to get in to. Sad that this happened if you are the NDP, as Leyton was certainly a draw, and the rookie MPs they have need experienced folk like Leyton. As for those who voted Conservative, you have also lost out as a strong opposition makes for a stronger government. The opposition is weaker now than it was, at least in the short-term.
2. Leyton gave 'the best days' of his life for sure for Canadians. Some folks will go so far as to say his recent campaigning took the good out of him (he certainly got very sick right after the election). That said, I would not compare his work to the dangers faced each night and day by our armed forces and police officers, who expect to be put into danger each time they punch the clock.
3. You can't compare Leyton to any other MP or party leader. He holds the office of the leader of the opposition, which is something worth noting over the other MPs (we even provide an official opposition leader residence called Stornoway, and when the government loses confidence of the house he can be asked to be the new PM...so he is high on the PM list in our system). I personally think we should get rid of all state funerals, but it is not absurd that if you should have one, a sitting opposition leader would be a candidate to have one.
4. I think Leyton should be proud of the name "Taliban Jack." He advocated a position years ago that the Pentagon is just now realizing. He stood up for this when it politically incorrect to do so. That takes pure guts, and we don't have many politicians with guts today. You don't have to agree with him, but many others have come around to.
Otherwise, not much more to say other than the same old arguments that we tend to get in to. Sad that this happened if you are the NDP, as Leyton was certainly a draw, and the rookie MPs they have need experienced folk like Leyton. As for those who voted Conservative, you have also lost out as a strong opposition makes for a stronger government. The opposition is weaker now than it was, at least in the short-term.
In the 1997 federal election Preston Manning was re-elected and the Reform Party won 60 seats, making it the Official Opposition...thus my analogy. After EVERY election there is an "official opposition" leader. Yes it is special...but not state funeral level special. IF we give state's funeral to every schmoe who came up short (as 2nd place is just another way of saying "first loser")...we'd be bankrupted PDQ. Giving him one just cheapens it for the ones who DESERVE it.
YMMV :thumb:
I believe Jack would have been the FIRST to have criticized this idea. It's a woeful use of taxpayer money. And despite the 'lavish' spending, it actually cheapens the principle of a State Funeral.
Jack was a nice guy. He made people feel good during election campaigns, and during his career. But so do a lot of other politicians. What's more, the Conservative Party is using the death of the man to curry favor; at least that's how it feels.
Based on what? His legislative record? His happy TV commercials? A big smiley face on a campaign bus? Let's be realistic here. There's no partisan shades. It's genuine criticism about spending, and one organization's using a dead man's popularity to bolster their own.
Jack was a nice guy. He made people feel good during election campaigns, and during his career. But so do a lot of other politicians. What's more, the Conservative Party is using the death of the man to curry favor; at least that's how it feels.
Based on what? His legislative record? His happy TV commercials? A big smiley face on a campaign bus? Let's be realistic here. There's no partisan shades. It's genuine criticism about spending, and one organization's using a dead man's popularity to bolster their own.
I think Leyton actually put his stamp on Toronto more than nationally. He was big in getting affordable housing going in Toronto, and issues with the homeless. Nationally, I think his efforts to get the White Ribbon campaign started in Canada (anti-violence against women campaign) might be his biggest legacy.
Yikes... I wish people stopped living in a tinfoil house thinking that everything in the world is out to get them or has alternative motives behind it.
What does a PR stunt matter to someone who is not going to be around. If I were on my death bed I think I'd like to say something to my family and friends there to encourage them to move forward as well. In his case he is a politician and had connections with people nation wide so his open letter is fitting of his position. I read the letter and I didn't feel I was having an opinion forced upon me for political gains I felt I was reading the letter of a man who has led a positive life and is encouraging others to move forwards in life and live a good life.
What the media and other people are doing to try and make gains out of this is one thing but to directly criticize him for it? I duno... it seems pretty dumb.
Dude, the man was a politician. If you think that ANY politician doesnt have ten different motives for doing anything you are fooling yourself. Maybe its because you are still young and shiny (or at least I assume you are based on your Political POV). Give it a couple decades and then talk to me about how honest politicians are...and how they just want to serve Canada with no ulterior motives
He knew he was toast and he wanted to use his own death as a way for the NDP to garner some sympathy. Most likely he knew that the NDP were screwed and the young'uns were going to be inserting their feet into their mouths a LOT (its a steep learning curve) so he wanted to get CNDs to cut them some more slack...AND maybe win a few converts.
Did he also do it so that the last thing he would be remembered for was for a happy happy joy joy letter and NOT filibustering for 5 days ("team-building exercise" as they put it) and then slinking off into the night when his masters told him to stop (the unions)..probably. Thats just two ulterior motives that are just as likely as he wanted to be all happy happy joy joy and go into that goodnight with courage and dignity. There is probably more that we don't know about as they were aimed at not the Gen Pub but other politicks.
In other words don't be such a fool to think that a MASTER politician like Jack (and hate him or love him he was one of the best of his generation) would let such a "once in a lifetime" opportunity pass him by. His party is on life support BUT thankfully has 4 years to rebuild, and hopefully his wife can find a way to continue on sooner rather than later. Hopefully she doesnt die of a broken heart and hopefully the NDP will rebuild and come back to keep the libs from becoming official opposition in 4yrs time.
He knew he was toast and he wanted to use his own death as a way for the NDP to garner some sympathy. Most likely he knew that the NDP were screwed and the young'uns were going to be inserting their feet into their mouths a LOT (its a steep learning curve) so he wanted to get CNDs to cut them some more slack...AND maybe win a few converts.
Did he also do it so that the last thing he would be remembered for was for a happy happy joy joy letter and NOT filibustering for 5 days ("team-building exercise" as they put it) and then slinking off into the night when his masters told him to stop (the unions)..probably. Thats just two ulterior motives that are just as likely as he wanted to be all happy happy joy joy and go into that goodnight with courage and dignity. There is probably more that we don't know about as they were aimed at not the Gen Pub but other politicks.
In other words don't be such a fool to think that a MASTER politician like Jack (and hate him or love him he was one of the best of his generation) would let such a "once in a lifetime" opportunity pass him by. His party is on life support BUT thankfully has 4 years to rebuild, and hopefully his wife can find a way to continue on sooner rather than later. Hopefully she doesnt die of a broken heart and hopefully the NDP will rebuild and come back to keep the libs from becoming official opposition in 4yrs time.
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I agree with this. Unforunately, not enough people share these sentiments so the Government is using a PR move to smooth over voters. I guess that is worth spending tax payers' money.
No, what seems pretty dumb is having to read constant comments about people wearing tinfoil hats for anyone who doesn't agree with them especially if the perspective is perceived as a critique and not the typical supporting the party line.
The other thing, if Layton would be against the state funeral, how come not one NDP member is standing up saying that they shouldn't be using public spending for it?
I guess they don't care about it so it's even easier for Harper to go ahead. No complaints by the parties, few complaints and none that are vocal or loud by the people or media. Who cares if they are spending more money. After all, it's just paper.
Even on HWC there is a debate about spending the money. The party that says that we shouldn't be spending the money would get exactly 4 votes. It is sad, but many people, not just Canadians but throughout the world, will vote purely off of emotions.
different note:
Layton is currently viewed as the "god guy" who only did an honest job. People are saying that he was a beacon of hope for a good politician, and anyone else is a lying scumbag, which is just plain wrong. That is what is ticking me off the most. Sure he might have acted like a good guy, but there is not a single politician that has not done something "back room" or other things that the general public would not like.
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